SOHC Civic Hatch

[BigFlee]

I know everyone on here dislikes hondas just as much as I do but just throwing it out there that my buddies civic hatch with the greddy turbo kit ran a 13.49 at NTR.

[Baluchitherium4]

Street tires or slicks? What MPH?

[DQ Driver]

I love hatchbacks.

real CAR guys don't care what it is, as long as it's FAST.
car FAGS think their shit is the greatest and it's usually the slowest.

[dan toops]

good statment luoong

[hndaklr]

I love fast cars, especionaly DMS, but I just get tired of the aftermarket industry flooding the store with s*!t loads of honda parts. I go into a store (autozone, advance auto, passen, etc.) and see somethin I want for my car and IT"S FOR A HONDA! "I'm sorry sir, but we can order it for your car" or " No, I do not see a listing for that for your car, only honda, mazda, or toyota and oh ya, Hundai" :cuss I just wish there was a store in Columbus, Dayton, or Chillicothe that stocked DSM stuff. I had to have Advanced Auto order my NGK spark plugs!

[10spdhuffy]

I go into a store (autozone, advance auto, passen, etc.) and see somethin I want for my car and IT"S FOR A HONDA
APC isn't just for hondas.

[TRBOCHK]

But it looks so good on hondas.. :D

[talon guy]

But it looks so good on hondas.. :D

+1 :beer

[DQ Driver]

But it looks so good on hondas.. :D

+1 :beer

Hey everyone, let's rip on Honda's some more since your cars are so fast. Oh wait neither of your cars have come close to the lil' Honda in the thread, so...

STFU

[talon guy]

But it looks so good on hondas.. :D

+1 :beer

Hey everyone, let's rip on Honda's some more since your cars are so fast. Oh wait neither of your cars have come close to the lil' Honda in the thread, so...

STFU

:Owned but do i care? nope apc still looks good on hondas :booty

[TRBOCHK]

Actually, you can shut the fuck up. Mike (10spdhuffy) is a very good friend of mine, as are a bunch of guys with hondas. He knew I was joking, and I never have once said my car is fast what so ever. I have no idea what my car would do. So thanks for the input Mike, but you are truly an :asshole


:D

[dsmarc]

i want a honda
:confused
not joking

[harry's94tsi]

i want a honda
:confused
not joking

at least it would run more than the car you have now :thumb

[DSM614]

this is a drag racing post, not a stupid ricer let's talk about apc dumbass bullshit.

APC dont look good on anything because its fucking ghey, and talking about it on the board makes us look like losers.

so STFU about it.

[DQ Driver]

Actually, you can shut the fuck up.... So thanks for the input Mike, but you are truly an :asshole
:D

THANKS... it's not a good day without being called one

kissy kissy

[hndaklr]

Just so u know, I was not talking about APC crap. I was talking in general about various situations, such as my NGK plugs. I bet if I had a Honda they would have had then in stock. I just like to be able to walk into a DSM store and buy an UIP, or Magnicore Plug Wires, or a set of 550 or 660 injectors without having to get hem off the internet or have to wit for them to be ordered and shipped.

[04_srt_4]

BigFlee is this Andy Doranns (sp?) car, if so I believe he is selling it and switching to an EVO. There was also a red hatch running 13's last year with turbo and I believe he was trapping the 100-102 range.

[BigFlee]

Yeah it's Andys car and he isnt selling it. Its crossed his mind a few times but it's not going to happen. He had it dyno'd and with the ic sprayer it jumped 50 horses, but he hasnt ran it with the spray at the track yet he's scared :D

[MrBlunt]

co2, nitrous or water sprayer?

[Iwishiwascool]

what a waste of nitrous.

Co2 works just as well but I would bet he used nitrous since thats the fast and furious thing to do.

[MrBlunt]

i figured one of the two first ones. if he used water and got that i'm hooking mine up tomorrow :D

[Iwishiwascool]

i have a diy co2 one that I have yet to install

[MrBlunt]

i've been wanting to do this. my dis2 programmable will control it w/n an rpm window. would be cool for the track.

[Iwishiwascool]

ive got a hobbes switch to kick it on above the set boost level.

[integranator]

i figured one of the two first ones. if he used water and got that i'm hooking mine up tomorrow :D

Its a nitrous sprayer. I don't know if this is true to everyone or not, but I've been told that the nitrous/co2 can cause a lean condition (more dense air blah blah) if not properly tuned for it. So i guess you would have to run two different maps for the off/on bottle situation.

[Iwishiwascool]

enter: the confusion between a nitrous intercooler sprayer and nitrous injection

Sprayer: A cooler gas sprayed on the surface of the intercooler increases efficiency by dissipating accumulated heat thereby lowering intake temp. Anytime you lower intake temps the air is going to be denser according to our Ideal Gas Law. The over all density change is not half as hard to tune for as....

Injection: Nitrous is injected into the enclosed intake stream. This has the dual effect of drastically reducing intake temp and adding a great deal of oxygen. The combo of decreasing the temp and adding an oxygen rich molecule would create a dramatically lean condition if more fuel were not added.


In other words you can spray just about anything on your intercooler and have the same effect, But you wont be as cool or as poor since nitrous costs 4x as much as co2. If you tried to inject CO2 into your intake stream.... you would be called an "idiot".

[BigFlee]

Its a nitrous sprayer on the ic and anything that gives 50 horsies to the wheels is never a waste.

[Iwishiwascool]

im saying that nitrous is 4x as expensive as co2 but co2 will work just as well.

So yes its a waste of perfectly good nitrous. The amount sprayed on the intercooler would probably be equal to a 300 shot internally.

[integranator]

enter: the confusion between a nitrous intercooler sprayer and nitrous injection

Sprayer: A cooler gas sprayed on the surface of the intercooler increases efficiency by dissipating accumulated heat thereby lowering intake temp. Anytime you lower intake temps the air is going to be denser according to our Ideal Gas Law. The over all density change is not half as hard to tune for as....

Injection: Nitrous is injected into the enclosed intake stream. This has the dual effect of drastically reducing intake temp and adding a great deal of oxygen. The combo of decreasing the temp and adding an oxygen rich molecule would create a dramatically lean condition if more fuel were not added.


In other words you can spray just about anything on your intercooler and have the same effect, But you wont be as cool or as poor since nitrous costs 4x as much as co2. If you tried to inject CO2 into your intake stream.... you would be called an "idiot".

Wow, Was that really neccesary? I'm not sure what point you were trying to get across?

[04_srt_4]

Ken, be careful when using co2 though, as there is nothing stoping the co2 or nitrous from spraying into the air filter, and on a honda it is right down there by the ic, co2 when injested in the motor is not good for power, I dont know if it actaully harms anything, check this out

http://www.cryofuzion.com/products.htm#Cheetah

Nitrous going in the motor will make power though.

Andy is using a NX Ntercoooler sprayer with nitrous, When i spoke with andy at the import life show in columbus he said following the nopi racewars show in virginia that the should be headed back to ohio now from that he was selling the car, he wanted $15,000 for it, and he would be purchasing an EVO after he sold the car. Maybe things have changed in a week ? :confused

[Iwishiwascool]

Wow, Was that really neccesary? I'm not sure what point you were trying to get across?

Just because a post follows yours does not mean it was solely meant for your big brain. This is an automotive site meant to provide information to those who care to read it. It was an opportune time to point out some differences that the beginner tooner is likely not aware of. I, and every body else, are fine with the fact that you are above such posts of remedial knowledge. Your attitude is not appreciated.

If you are not interested in said info, no one is forcing your browser to point here.
:thumb

[Iwishiwascool]

Ken, be careful when using co2 though, as there is nothing stoping the co2 or nitrous from spraying into the air filter, and on a honda it is right down there by the ic, co2 when injested in the motor is not good for power, I dont know if it actaully harms anything, check this out

Quite right, I will address that problem when the install is done.

[integranator]

Wow, Was that really neccesary? I'm not sure what point you were trying to get across?

Just because a post follows yours does not mean it was solely meant for your big brain. This is an automotive site meant to provide information to those who care to read it. It was an opportune time to point out some differences that the beginner tooner is likely not aware of. I, and every body else, are fine with the fact that you are above such posts of remedial knowledge. Your attitude is not appreciated.

If you are not interested in said info, no one is forcing your browser to point here.
:thumb

quite the contrary, I wasn't trying to have any attitude, or be "above" said post. I merely did not understand what type of comment that was-- now that it has been cleared up, I am much happier. Thank you.

[Mike C]

I have a hard time believing that a superficial IC sprayer (N2O, CO2) can yield 50whp. Has this ever been documented on a dyno?

[jplong]

i aggree....
lookat the big dogs do they run them?....i see it as a waste of gas.

[04_srt_4]

Mike C, I actaully believe it could gain it, but not by the spraying alone, when the sprayer is in operation the excess nitrous that is over sprayed/relfected from the ic is actually being injested into the air intake track/ filter system and therefore into the motor, that would net 50whp.

[Jarod]

i hardly doubt the small amount that is getting pulled through the intake would net 50. but just my 2 cents

[04_srt_4]

its actaually a good bit, there is no restrictor fitting on the nitrous going to the spray to my knowledge, so would you consider a staight shot into the intake a little bit ? Even though it is hitting the ic it sprays off to the sides, I have seen this car spray it at my local car show last year, it defiantly will be gettin at least 20hp worth of juice just from the overspray intake, andy has his on a wot switch, so the whole run down the track it will be spraying, many people with a sprayer bar just "purge" or mist the ic beofore making their pass, purging or misting I would see no harm in using co2 just because it wouldnt be injested, and would save a lot of money. Current Nitrous rate of $4.00 (Jegs) is not cheap to just blast away into the air.

[Mike C]

Mike C, I actaully believe it could gain it, but not by the spraying alone, when the sprayer is in operation the excess nitrous that is over sprayed/relfected from the ic is actually being injested into the air intake track/ filter system and therefore into the motor, that would net 50whp.

I thought that the concept was to chill the fins of the IC so extremely that they naturally cooled the charge air to a dramatically cooler temp. I never realized that it was assumed there was some ingestion of nitrous. It seems very ineffecient and I don't really understand why you wouldn't just run a dry shot near the throttle body if someone would go through all the plumbing trouble anyway.

[Mike C]

PS... I'm guessing that after tomorrow, I'll really like nitrous.

[Iwishiwascool]

it is not assumed, its possible... but certainly not the way it was intended.

My Intake will be quite clear of the IC sprayer. That whole forward motion thing also helps keep it going laterally rather than up to the intake too ;)

[integranator]

Can anyone find the vid of the crazy SRT-4 dyno'ing and spraying the bottle at the same time? I think they said that they put down some extra hp w/ it. They pushed like 450+ish?

[Jarod]

with the forward motion and all the air mixing with it when being sprayed and the intake being where it is, i just dont see how anything that would count for much would make it in. maybe better chances on a smic with a ram air setup goin to the intake.

[BigFlee]

I'll give Andy a call tomorrow and see if he'll give me some copies of it being dyno'd with and without the sprayer. And yes it was 50 whp.

[Mike C]

I haven't seen much arguing. It seems like healthy discussion to me about something technical for a change.

[OWNDJOO]

i concurr sir :beer

[Jarod]

Who's arguing

[Mike C]

Who's arguing

The post was edited. Its all good.

[04_srt_4]

Can anyone find the vid of the crazy SRT-4 dyno'ing and spraying the bottle at the same time? I think they said that they put down some extra hp w/ it. They pushed like 450+ish?

That would be rezin8 from the srt forums, he had a colletor made to direct all of the nitrous overspray from the ic directly into the airbox, and it created like 58whp, I believe he made 360hp. The only 450+ srt is currently having the motor replaced, but you can see pics of it in modified magazine.

Mike C, I think you will really like nitrous too.

If I can win the pm bidding war on a certain somebodys SAFC unit, then I should have a 400+ vid for you of an SRT-4. Or you can just see me at the track.

[integranator]

Can anyone find the vid of the crazy SRT-4 dyno'ing and spraying the bottle at the same time? I think they said that they put down some extra hp w/ it. They pushed like 450+ish?

That would be rezin8 from the srt forums, he had a colletor made to direct all of the nitrous overspray from the ic directly into the airbox, and it created like 58whp, I believe he made 360hp. The only 450+ srt is currently having the motor replaced, but you can see pics of it in modified magazine.

.

This motor is completely stock bottom end:
http://www.cheesefrog.com/frog/stevedyno_01.jpg

Mods:
GT3040R
Tial 38mm
Tial BOV
Mopar stage 1 ECU
PowerPaq piggy back fuel computer
Griphin i.c.
Aeromotive A1000 pump
#8 feed
#4 return (from previous tuner)
Precision 880cc Injectors
HONDA Injector resistor

That was done on 114octane. Pretty amazing number eh? Oh and this was done less than a month ago- and his motor is doin fine!

[04_srt_4]

Sorry but your wrong ..............That is the car of Steven Anderson, from Texas, I speak with steve about once a month, His motor is definately not doing fine.

A new motor is going into the car to make 600+ on stock bottom end, and then by mid summer neonparts.net should have Steves full race 2.6liter race motor ready.

http://www.srtforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=48992&highlight=steve+anderson+blew

[integranator]

Well i'll be damned--- i thought that thing was going to be a freak!! So what do u think the "safe/reliable" hp level is for your motors?

edit: one thing for sure is that I believe stock for stock, the SRT-4 motor is probably one of the best 4cyl turbo motors to date.

[04_srt_4]

well steve has 100+ track run and over 400 dyno sheets, and does extreme testing as he is very well off financialy, It has been guestimated to be around 500-550whp before the stress on the internals becomes too much. I dont know alot about motors so if anybody wants to elaborate on that then fine. Steve said a week before the car blew that they had a boost accident as he accidentally unplugged something and turned the boost to 42lbs. After discovering that car did not blow there, he decided to keep it in that range. He has been the pioneer for srt-4's since the begining. Like he said he has a large buget for his car, so basically money is not an issue, he wants to do it slow so that others can follow and be safe in doing so. His entire turbo set used to make the 500+ is now for sale as he is going with a much larger turbo setup and will not tell anybody what it is going to be, but he is guarnateing a 10second pass on stock internals this week so we will see I guess, myfault from the srtfourms has loaned him the current engine until neonparts completes his race motor.

[Mike C]

What is the red line on those cars? Does he have any headwork done or cams? It reaches full power around 5300 which is good but its already down 50whp by 6300 and falling steadily. I know its a 2.4 but thats a pretty narrow power band.

[Gunner]

So how ya like that there nitrous Mr. Colapietro? :D NICE!

[Mike C]

So how ya like that there nitrous Mr. Colapietro? :D NICE!

No comment. Rich know's a secret :thumb

[04_srt_4]

What is the red line on those cars? Does he have any headwork done or cams? It reaches full power around 5300 which is good but its already down 50whp by 6300 and falling steadily. I know its a 2.4 but thats a pretty narrow power band.

Rev limiter is in full affect at 6200RPM - I know from a few missed shifts, The newly released Mopar Stage 2 increases the rev limit to 6500rpm. Steve has stock head, stock cams, basically a fuel setup, piggy back and turbo upgrade with new designed manifold because mopar is stupid and put half the guts inside the mainfold, so a tubular or log style is required for a turbo upgrade.

[smokeshank]

But it looks so good on hondas.. :D

+1 :beer

Hey everyone, let's rip on Honda's some more since your cars are so fast. Oh wait neither of your cars have come close to the lil' Honda in the thread, so...

STFU

:Owned but do i care? nope apc still looks good on hondas :booty

<--- trying to fight erge to post your last two vechicle pics... argh....
pulsar with wing, integra with seat belt pads... mr. ricer him self talking :)
but its all good, everyone has their 16yr old ricer moments. glad mine was over 2 cars ago.

[talon guy]

hey there r a couple people that i know that had some riced out cars befor we went to the dark side and got dsm's....its all in the past my friend :beer

[smokeshank]

hey there r a couple people that i know that had some riced out cars befor we went to the dark side and got dsm's....its all in the past my friend :beer

ant!

[Caine]

Well i'll be damned--- i thought that thing was going to be a freak!! So what do u think the "safe/reliable" hp level is for your motors?

edit: one thing for sure is that I believe stock for stock, the SRT-4 motor is probably one of the best 4cyl turbo motors to date.

Have you ever been in an Evo? With like $2000, you can make an Evo super fast. And as far as I know the srt-4 is stock with like 230 or 240 hp. The Evo is alot higher than that. Im not sure of the numbers but I have driven both stock cars and the Evo woops the shit out of the Srt.

Sorry if I offeneded anyone just giving my opinion. The srt-4 is a nice car, but I just disagree with the statement. And was wondering if maybe integranator was refering to a match between the older 4G63 to the srt-4.

[04_srt_4]

Well i'll be damned--- i thought that thing was going to be a freak!! So what do u think the "safe/reliable" hp level is for your motors?

edit: one thing for sure is that I believe stock for stock, the SRT-4 motor is probably one of the best 4cyl turbo motors to date.

Have you ever been in an Evo? With like $2000, you can make an Evo super fast. And as far as I know the srt-4 is stock with like 230 or 240 hp. The Evo is alot higher than that. Im not sure of the numbers but I have driven both stock cars and the Evo woops the shit out of the Srt.

Sorry if I offeneded anyone just giving my opinion. The srt-4 is a nice car, but I just disagree with the statement. And was wondering if maybe integranator was refering to a match between the older 4G63 to the srt-4.

Sorry caine, but have you ever seen a dyno for an Stock evo ? has anybody ? stock srt-4 will put 230 to the wheels any stock evo's putting 271 to the ground ? I have no disrespect for the Evo as I would of much rather had an evo, just bringing the fact that the Evo is not ALOT higher in the stock hp area.

[MrBlunt]

Dont forget the 6-7K difference in price. The neon is a great car for the money, it destroys everything in its price range. From most magazines i've read i've seen around 225whp out of the neon and a rather consistent low 14 sec pass.

[integranator]

And i'll say it again-- when you see an evo, or a fwd 4g63 motor put down 500+hp on stock untouched motor? And not just a hks drag car, or something like that--- but just by people like you and I.


Edit: i guess my "stock for stock" comment is misleading. I mean stock head/block.

[92tsiawd]

By far the neon is a great value, hell I almost bought one. But the extra 6K gets you alot of braking and mobility. The evo's are one of the best handling cars I've driven in the 30K price range. Again I'm not knocking the neon they are a great car for the money. I thought the evo was putting like 227whp, and the neon was like 220whp. The only thing I didn't like about the neon was front wheel drive, the car seemed to dive real hard while cornering. I might still buy one in the near future you never know :D

I would love to go for a ride in a mod neon to see the difference!!!!

[MrBlunt]

i dont think anyones dumb enough to try. i guess they don't reliably hold that much hp, he blew his motor up

[Mike C]

And i'll say it again-- when you see an evo, or a fwd 4g63 motor put down 500+hp on stock untouched motor? And not just a hks drag car, or something like that--- but just by people like you and I.


Edit: i guess my "stock for stock" comment is misleading. I mean stock head/block.

Call Dave Buschur and ask him how many 500whp+ dyno pulls they have made on their stock block EVO shop car in the past few weeks :thumb Also, the 1 SRT4 that I know of that was making that kind of power is currently getting its motor built.

[integranator]

And i'll say it again-- when you see an evo, or a fwd 4g63 motor put down 500+hp on stock untouched motor? And not just a hks drag car, or something like that--- but just by people like you and I.


Edit: i guess my "stock for stock" comment is misleading. I mean stock head/block.

Call Dave Buschur and ask him how many 500whp+ dyno pulls they have made on their stock block EVO shop car in the past few weeks :thumb Also, the 1 SRT4 that I know of that was making that kind of power is currently getting its motor built.

If you look at the end of my statement-- i meant by the common person--- not a shop car, such as a buschur shop car, or a hks drag car, so that has no validity. Because the point is that I don't doubt that those cars can push that much hp, I just meant by ease of user, tuner friendly blah blah, but I guess I should have specified! :thumb

[Caine]

NEither can a Srt-4 but ok. Im not going to get into this not on a DSM board, this is the wrong place to do this.

[M 4 L k i 3 R]

Going back to the original topic.....................

Part of the reason that a sprayer on the IC works so well on a dyno is...well...air isn't moving past the IC at the same rate. Yes, I do know that they put a good fan in front of the cars when they dyno them, BUT can you honestly tell me that the air being pushed by the fan is the same sort of air that you are going to be ramming your IC with down the highway or track? Depending on how far the fan is positioned from the car, the fan can either push faster air at the IC in the shape of a doughnut (fan is close to the car) or it can push slower air at the IC in the shape of a circle (fan farther back from the car).

penny/2

[Mike C]

And i'll say it again-- when you see an evo, or a fwd 4g63 motor put down 500+hp on stock untouched motor? And not just a hks drag car, or something like that--- but just by people like you and I.


Edit: i guess my "stock for stock" comment is misleading. I mean stock head/block.

Call Dave Buschur and ask him how many 500whp+ dyno pulls they have made on their stock block EVO shop car in the past few weeks :thumb Also, the 1 SRT4 that I know of that was making that kind of power is currently getting its motor built.

If you look at the end of my statement-- i meant by the common person--- not a shop car, such as a buschur shop car, or a hks drag car, so that has no validity. Because the point is that I don't doubt that those cars can push that much hp, I just meant by ease of user, tuner friendly blah blah, but I guess I should have specified! :thumb

Why does everything with you have to be such a damn confrontation? Why are you here? What makes their "shop" car so different? It is a stock block/stock drivetrain (except clutch), full weight car with a bunch of bolt ons, a turbo kit, and an EMS. Its far from a "drag" car. Maybe you should know a little bit more about OUR cars before you run your mouth on OUR board. They/I could put the same parts on my EVO in 1 man day.