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View Full Version : Over heating issue...RESOLVED

Kapok6
09-20-2011, 07:13 PM
Mods, if this belongs in the tech section, please move.


Alright, so I have a new motor built by yours truly, and a few weeks ago it had about 40 miles on it. Not it kept overheating within a few short miles of driving. It would overheat faster when boosting. Not nearly as quickly when cruising and staying out of boost. First thoughts, HG. But, lets eliminate the simple stuff first. I removed the thermostat, replaced the radiator cap, and made sure air was out of the cooling system. I also wired my fans to run the whole time the car is on. No change. Still over heated. I pressure tested the cooling system. It held pressure, no leaks. I change radiators, no change. I don't have any of the stock duct work and some argued this is what could be causing it. I disagreed as I have never an stock duct work and I know others that do not as well without any ill effects. This is the same small FMIC I used on my last car as well and I had no overheating issues. So now I am like, It's gott be an HG issue. I pull the head, and sure enough is a tiny piece of aluminum between the head and the HG leading into a water source right by CYL # 2. Pics of the piece of aluminum are below, we stukc it to the oil dipstick. Man it was tiny. Also, CYL # 2 in both the bore and on the head was cleaner than the other cylinders. The aluminum left a nice little indentation on the head. Great. I probably need to go have the head milled now. WRONG. I met a guy here that owns 4 dsm's, and is a mechaninc by trade, and definitely a DIYer. He sugested using gasket shellac on the head, both sides of the HG and the block. He said the shellac would fill in the small indentation by the water hole not allowing it to pass into the cylinder anymore. Being completely sick of spending time and money on the project, having no money to spend anyway, and knowing he has a ton of experience with DSM's and all his run, I said lets give it a go and that's what I did. Cleaned the surfaces with non-chlorinated carb cleaner, I aplied the shellac, put the head on, torque the ARP's to 100ftlbs with moly lube, put the car back together and went to start it....

It fired right up. I let it idle for 1hr (I put my new ceramic coated, ported evo 3 EM on and it has to idle for an hour so the coating can cure), and no overheating issues after idling for an hour. I take it for a drive that evening, no overheating on low boost. I Have driven the car the last few days and been beating on it pretty hard and had no overheating issues at all.

I am not saying I recommend this solution, but it has definitely worked thus far. I will keep everyone updated if something does go wrong as a result of how I fixed the issue.

http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a461/RyanCorlew/DSM%20Engine/IMG_2756.jpg

http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a461/RyanCorlew/DSM%20Engine/IMG_2755.jpg

http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a461/RyanCorlew/DSM%20Engine/IMG_2768.jpg

http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a461/RyanCorlew/DSM%20Engine/IMG_2767.jpg

http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a461/RyanCorlew/DSM%20Engine/IMG_2766.jpg

http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a461/RyanCorlew/DSM%20Engine/IMG_2758.jpg

http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a461/RyanCorlew/DSM%20Engine/IMG_2757.jpg
pavochavo
09-20-2011, 09:39 PM
Man I'm glad you got that taken care of. I would hate to see that beast hurt by such a tiny piece of metal. I wish your DSM friend was around here (and you too) cause I'd totally have you guys come help me out. ;) I hope all is well down there.


Pavo
ucsigep
09-21-2011, 09:54 AM
Gotta love DSM'ers... Band-aids all the way. :)
Kapok6
09-21-2011, 01:41 PM
Band aid? Shoot, this is the fix, not the cover hiding the issue ha ha. Different ways to fix one problem.
BlackEclipse
09-21-2011, 02:56 PM
Is that a metal HG or a composite one? Looks like a metal one.
Kapok6
09-21-2011, 03:04 PM
Metal.
ucsigep
09-21-2011, 04:00 PM
nah, the right way to fix it is what you didn't want to do. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the band-aid route was bad! I love the ingenuity in DSMer's across the country. I'm just saying that in our 7 second dragster, there is no way in hell our motor guy would ever do anything other than resurface everything, or just replace the parts.

You even say, "I am not saying I recommend this solution..." If it wasn't a band-aid, why wouldn't you recommend it? :) My only concern is the fact that I have always been under the impression that gasket shellac is typically for low temp, low pressure applications. I could be wrong, though, since I've always just used RTV red.
Kapok6
09-21-2011, 07:50 PM
nah, the right way to fix it is what you didn't want to do. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the band-aid route was bad! I love the ingenuity in DSMer's across the country. I'm just saying that in our 7 second dragster, there is no way in hell our motor guy would ever do anything other than resurface everything, or just replace the parts.

You even say, "I am not saying I recommend this solution..." If it wasn't a band-aid, why wouldn't you recommend it? :) My only concern is the fact that I have always been under the impression that gasket shellac is typically for low temp, low pressure applications. I could be wrong, though, since I've always just used RTV red.

This is not a 7 second car ha ha

I wouldn't recommend it because I do not have the trial and error data to prove unequivocally that this can be done with 0 issues. Give me a year of driving and we will see where we are at then. I am not too prideful to admit in a year if this method turned out to be a bad idea. That's why I am not recommending it yet. Time will tell.

Yes, MFG recommendation is for low temp low pressure. And viagra was invented to help heart issues. Yet look what its primarily used for. People find other uses for products. The guy that helped me did this with his daily driver 2g 4 years ago and has had 0 issues and he also did it to his 1G that he pushes 25psi+ o hx35 on multiple times a week beating the ever living piss out of his car for a year and no issues yet.

Another guy in columbus I know used the shellac on copper HG's for chevy's and VW's without issue.

I think it's too soon for anyone to say it's the wrong way if they haven't tried it and had ill effects, or know someone who tried it and had ill effects. So far the only evidence (not speculation) before me is proof that it works...:headbang
motozachl
09-22-2011, 10:39 AM
That IS a tiny piece, looks like 1mm thick though....oh and another reason to NOT use metal hg IMO as a composite most likely would've compensated for this shaving
Kapok6
09-22-2011, 11:41 AM
Yeah, I agree composite would have been better for the surface issue, however, it is my understanding that a metal HG can take more abuse from detonation than a composite and since I am still working on dialing my VE in and getting the tune right, I wanted to be on the safe side in case it goes to lean here and there while I am fine tuning things.